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Flight 1549 was No Miracle

January 16th, 2009

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You’re probably aware that just yesterday an aircraft taking off from LaGuadia Airport in New York was forced to ditch in the Hudson River after experiencing engine problems on takeoff.   Reports indicate that the aircraft may have suffered multiple bird strikes, possibly to both engines shortly after take off.   Although exactly what happened to the aircraft will not be known until a full investigation is conducted, it appears that the Airbus A320 encountered a flock of Canada grease which disabled at least one of the aircraft’s engines and prevented it from being able to maintain altitude, even to return to the airport.

Remarkably, nobody was killed in the incident.   The aircraft ditched in the Hudson at a time when the water temperature is cold enough to cause hypothermia within minutes and death shortly after.   The plane was loaded with 155 passengers and they had only minutes to prepare before going into the drink.

Many news reports are calling it a miracle and others are asking for thanks to god over the fact that nobody was killed or severely injured in the incident.   The worst injury was one woman with two broken legs, but most of the passengers walked away from the incident shaken and with wet socks, but otherwise in good condition.   Well, you can say I’m just a cynical atheist, but it really bothers me hearing this, even to the point bordering being offended.

First of all, if you are to suggest that god decided to micro-manage this flight and personally assure that nobody was hurt, then I might ask the obvious question of whether or not he could have just deflected the birds so that the plane wouldn’t have had to go down at all.   A more important question might be why god loved these people and their families so much more than he did those on other aircraft that went down with no survivors.

Really though, what offends me is that attributing these events and the successful outcome to the invisible man in the sky is very disingenuous to the hard working and unsung individuals who all contributed to make this event come out so successfully.   The pilot is getting plenty of praise, which he of course, deserves, but he was only one of the people whose actions helped out here.

I feel a bit similar on Christmas or Thanksgiving when my father says grace at the table and thanks god for the food we are about to receive from “his bounty.”   Give me a break!   How about the bounty of modern agriculture!  How about the scientists who figured out how to stop famine-causing pests or the farmers who grew this stuff.   How about some thanks to my mother for spending the day cooking everything.  When thanking god that we’re safely together for another year, why not stop and think about antibiotics or vaccines or antilock breaks and all the other things that very well may have saved our lives without us even thinking about.

Who Really Deserves Credit:

The Pilot – He has certainly not been forgotten in the rush to thank the invisible man in the sky, but the actions of the pilot of the plane that went down were, by all accounts, by the book and flawless.   When it became apparent that the aircraft experienced problems and could not continue as planned, Captain Chesley “Sully” Sullenberger radioed the tower and prepared to return to the airport.   However, when the aircraft continued to lose altitude and could not make it back, he managed to avoid any danger to the City of New York by lining up the aircraft with the only clear space in the area:  The Hudson River.

Sullenberger, an Air Force veteran, then landed the aircraft perfectly in the water, a difficult maneuver that requires the pilot to come down in a manner different than would be used for a standard landing.   Ditching in water can be very dangerous, as coming in too fast or steep can cause the plane to tumble or even snap.  Once this happens, the aircraft can sink quickly.   However, Sullenbergs landing did not damage the structure of the aircraft and thus it remained on the surface long enough for everyone to get out.

Before finally existing the plane, Sullenberger checked the entire passenger cabin to make sure nobody was left.   He was the last one off.

Other Crew Members – From the co-pilot to the flight attendants, all crew on a modern airliner are trained in emergency procedures for such occasions, they are tasked with keeping passengers calm and getting them to exit the plane in an orderly manner even when the prospect of the aircraft sinking could cause panic.

The Passengers - Although likely to be overlooked, the passengers are an important factor in whether or not life is lost in this kind of an accident.   They followed the orders of the crew and got out of the aircraft without incident.   It may not be what they did as much as it is what they didn’t do.   They didn’t mob the exist or fight to grab carry on baggage.  They did not panic or fight flight crew to be the first one out or disobey the instructions of the crew.   The reality of a situation like this is that a single person panicking and creating a conflict can lead to tragedy.   Cool heads saved lives.

Ferry Boat Crews Others Who Responded – Captain Vince Lombardi had just picked up passengers from Manhattan on a New York ferry that normally carries commuters from New York to New Jersey.   However, when the aircraft ditched in the Hudson, Lombardi was the first on the scene to rescue passengers from the icy waters. Lombardi and his crew did exactly what they needed to, they arrived on the scene of the crash within minutes, but took extreme care to come in gently and avoid the possibility of swamping the aircraft with their wake.

Lombardi was not the only local ferry captain to respond to the incident.   Captain David Martin’s ferry was also on the scene within minutes, as was Captain Juan Rosario’s vessel of the New York Circle Line.  The vessels which responded first threw life vests to the passengers, lowered their own life boats to pick up passengers and hosted passengers aboard by hand.

What makes the rescue by ferries or other civilian vessels so remarkable is not that they responded but that they managed to conduct the impromptu rescue operation in a professional and orderly manner.   There was no panic, no mobbing of the crash scene or swamping of the aircraft by the wakes of the vessels that responded.   They didn’t collide with each other or knock passengers off the wings of the aircraft.   This is really testament to the professionalism and the safety training of the ferry captains and crew.

The Numerous Engineers and Designers - A lot of work goes into a modern airliner and a lot of engineers at Airbus worked to build an aircraft that could survive a water landing and float for a reasonable amount of time to allow the passengers time to exit the plane.   Engineers, designers, safety experts and crash researchers all contribute to the design of modern aircraft, and water landings are just one of the events they plan for.    The fact that the aircraft was still stable and controllable after losing an engine and that it remained intact and able to float is testament to the efforts of all those who contributed to the design.

Air Traffic Controlers - They kept the skies in the area of the incident clear to prevent further dangers, remained calm and guided the aircraft first in its attempt to return to the airport and then into the river, having already notified emergency responders.

Many Others – Capt. Chesley B. Sullenberger isn’t just a pilot, he’s also been a safety insturctor with the FAA and consultant on airline procedures.   This should remind us of the fact that there are innumerable people working to develop the procedures for use in air emergencies, to investigate incidents and to learn from crashes or other incidents.   Each and every crash is investigated thoroughly and lessons learned contribute to the design of aircraft, engines and on board systems.   Pilots are trained for emergency situations, various contingency plans are studied and new procedures are tested.  Aircraft are also heavily regulated and inspected.  Commercial aircraft are subject to a battery of tests and all systems are certified to very high safety standards.   The safety of our current fleet of aircraft is proof of how well the system works.

Everyone, from the person who wrote the software for the flight simulators that pilots train on to the mechanics who maintain aircraft to the instructors who train pilots in emergency procedures has, in their own way, contributed something.   The invisible man in the sky has not.


This entry was posted on Friday, January 16th, 2009 at 10:41 pm and is filed under Bad Science, Culture, Good Science, Misc, religion. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed. You can leave a response, or trackback from your own site.
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35 Responses to “Flight 1549 was No Miracle”

  1. 1
    Chem Geek Gregor Says:

    So what else is new? People always credit god for good things but don’t blame him for the bad. “Yeah, I’d thank god for letting me live, except I’d really have preferred if he hadn’t sent my plane into the river to begin with.” Sometimes when someone dies they even spin it to god’s credit. “He wanted her back sooner because she’s an angel” or something. Bull****! My favorite is when you see a team win a football game or soemthing and they thank Jesus. Yeah, I guess Jesus rigs football games and loves you more than the other team. Nice of him to make the football game turn out your way but maybe he’d have done better if he used his magical powers to help someone who actually needed it like a starving child.

    I’d also love to see some time when the losing team goes away saying that they curse the name of God for favoring the other team. Yeah, like that’s ever going to happen!


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  2. 2
    DV82XL Says:

    Hear, hear!

    As ditchings go this was a textbook example, and kudos all around to those involved. No supernatural intersession need be invoked. It’s nice to see what can be done when everything that should happen, does happen in a row when responding to a situation like that.

    If it was a goose strike(s) that took the engines out, I hope the people that feed the damned things so that they hang around populated areas and winter over (which they will do if they have a food supply) are happy with themselves.


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  3. 3
    DV82XL Says:

    Not that I don’t like geese, I love them…with a savory stuffing and wild rice.


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  4. 4
    Engineering Edgar Says:

    A big goose is the kind of thing you can’t really expect an engine to take. I know that sometimes small birds have been sucked into engines and the engine still functions, even if the compressor blades are banged up to hell, but a goose I’d imagine would totally knock the engine out of commission. If this plane took a hit to both engines, which I guess they don’t know yet, then it’s pretty damn impressive that the pilot got it lined up and ditched like that because these aircraft are not very good gliders and when they’re so low to the ground and haven’t made it up to full speed, they’re only slightly better at flying than a rock. (Without engines that is)


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  5. 5
    Lou Says:

    Yes well people proclaim the name of God whenever something good happens and when something bad happens they don’t usually attribute it to God. The fact of the matter is that everything, even if it seems bad at the time, is part of the greater world and greater plan he has and we may see the good it brings about or we may not. Bad things do happen to good people and good things happen too and from what we can see it doesn’t seem to make sense, but we just have to know that he is never absent. I’m not saying whether God is responsible for everything that happens or not. We can’t ever know this. We are not capable of understanding it becasue God’s plan and his view of the world is too complex for us to understand and we shouldn’t be so disobedient and rash to demand to know why. The first step in faith is trust in God that he is there and then realize that each event does not really matter because of this. Once you trust in him you have begun to grow your faith.


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  6. 6
    DV82XL Says:

            Lou said:

    We are not capable of understanding it becasue God’s plan and his view of the world is too complex for us to understand and we shouldn’t be so disobedient and rash to demand to know why. The first step in faith is trust in God that he is there and then realize that each event does not really matter because of this. Once you trust in him you have begun to grow your faith.

    This idiotic view is just a manifestation of the extreme egotism of Christianity: the belief that God is intimately concerned with picayune aspects of, and directly intervenes in, the lives of individuals. If God, the creator and controller of the universe, is vitally concerned with your life, you must be pretty damned important. Many Christians take this particular form of egotism much further and actually imagine that God has a plan for them, or that God directly talks to, directs, or even does favors for them, ignoring the frequent and glaring contradictions in this supposed divine guidance, (and the dead bodies sometimes left in its wake.) But one can’t ignore the contradictions in, and the oftentimes horrible results of following such “divine guidance.”

    If you buy seriously and non-sceptically into this religious view of the world – I’m assuming here a fairly comprehensive one, not just a couple of key doctrines such as “the Abrahamic God exists” – then it’s likely that your whole life will be lived in accordance with a worldview that is, ex hypothesi, fundamentally and pervasively false. In that sense, everything you do and say will be distorted and your life will be structured in accordance with an illusion.

    I think that that’s a pretty sad fate


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  7. 7
    Russ Says:

    Well you know the thing about pilots is that they’re very highly trained and many are former military, but they do not use their skills 99% of the time. Modern aircraft are very easy to fly and they do really fly themselves so the pilot’s only actions could be as simple as setting some dials on the automated controls and so a normal uneventful flight you just about don’t need a pilot. It is situations like this or even less eventful situations like a sudden crosswind on landing where they have to correct it that make them necessary. This is where pilots earn their keep and why they are such a skilled and highly trained group that is held to such high standards.

    You’re right about everything though. The airlines are so safe not because of god but because of so many people who have worked so hard for so long to iron out practically every flaw in the design and operation of passenger planes. Of course, it’s also the people who were responsible here too like the crew and the ferry boat captains who did the right thing and arrived fast but didn’t crash or swamp it. There’s more of man’s handiwork here than God’s/


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  8. 8
    Borg22 Says:

    Yes I agree, the God factor just is so filled with holes not holiness. As one said, why not tell the birds to move out of the way. If God chose to save the plane rather than just move the birds, well God just seems stupid.
    Nice website, I will keep in touch with such sensible discourse.


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  9. 9
    J Says:

    Let’s not forget the engineers who built planes that can float after a water-landing evacuation, the actuaries at the insurance underwriters who put such a high value on passenger lives, the coders who support their creativity and insights, and the sysadmins who support the coders, and the men and women who compete in the industry trying to do even better.


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  10. 10
    SWC Says:

    Bet if you talked to any of the survivors they are thanking God .. God Bless you .. someday you too will need to call on His name .. and you will.


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  11. 11
    drbuzz0 Says:

            SWC said:

    Bet if you talked to any of the survivors they are thanking God .. God Bless you .. someday you too will need to call on His name .. and you will.

    I admit I do call the name of god on occasion in the context of “GOD DAMNIT” or “Oh Gawd!” but it’s rhetorical.

            J said:

    Let’s not forget the engineers who built planes that can float after a water-landing evacuation, the actuaries at the insurance underwriters who put such a high value on passenger lives, the coders who support their creativity and insights, and the sysadmins who support the coders, and the men and women who compete in the industry trying to do even better.

    Yeah, I mentioned the designing engineers who do account for the possibility of a water landing, and really there are innumerable men and women who contribute on some level in the industry or supporting industries. Obviously you can’t go around finding each and every one of them to thank, because it’s just too big a system and too many people each making a contribution directly or indirectly. We can, however, step back and realize how there is a huge number of individuals and organizations who are part of a system that works very well.

    No need to invoke any deities to find the contributors to the safety of modern transportation in general.


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  12. 12
    hanmeng Says:

            Lou said:

    We are not capable of understanding it becasue God’s plan and his view of the world is too complex for us to understand and we shouldn’t be so disobedient and rash to demand to know why.

    Who are you to say we shouldn’t be so disobedient and rash to demand to know why?

            SWC said:

    God Bless you .. someday you too will need to call on His name .. and you will.

    Or not. There are still a lot of us unbelievers around.


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  13. 13
    DV82XL Says:

            SWC said:

    Bet if you talked to any of the survivors they are thanking God .. God Bless you .. someday you too will need to call on His name .. and you will.

    The Christian appeal to fear, (which this statement is based on) is an admission that the evidence supporting Christian beliefs is far from compelling. If the evidence were such that Christianity’s truth was immediately apparent to anyone who considered it, Christians would feel no need to resort to the cheap tactic of using fear-inducing situations to inspire “belief.” “Lip service” is the more accurate term.

    If you think about it, these are the guys that invented FUD and honed it into an art. How omnipotent a deity is that if it needs this sort of PR.?


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  14. 14
    Castle Bravo Says:

    I am sure many will thank god for their survival. I am sure that many of the survivors prayed when they were told to brace for impact and thus they crdit this to their survival.

    I think that prayer in this kind of situation fulfills a kind of human need to have some kind of control or ability to do something. When you’re on a plane and the pilot tells you to brace for impact because hes going to ditch in the river there’s nothing you personally can really do about the situation. You’re in a bad situation and you have no control. The plane will go down safely or it may impact hard and kill you. What can you do but sit there and wait?

    This is where prayer comes in. It creates the illusion that you can do something constructive to actively help your situation. You beg a higher power to please let you live and you think if you beg hard enough and offer good enough reasons, like promising you’ll live a good life or something, that maybe you’ll convince him to intervene.

    When you think about it though, the very idea that prayer could help is disturbing to believe. It implies that there is a higher power who would let you go down in flames but might be swayed not to if you beg and plead enough. God would change his mind if you really ask hard enough? That seems very shallow and disturbing if you ask me.


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  15. 15
    Paul Says:

    Just a minor quibble. They are not “Canadian Geese,” they are “Canada Geese.” Or should I say, “were?”


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  16. 16
    TomInAK Says:

    A large number of factors outside the control of the air crew all fell together in an unlikely configuration which allowed the pilot to use his skill and training to pull off what I believe is history’s only successful ditching of a jet airliner. Had the engines cut out a few seconds earlier or later; had there been a bit of chop to the water; had the winds been different; all Capt. Sullenberger’s training and all the other factors cited in this post would have been for naught, and the press would be churning out tear-jerker stories about the unfortunate victims for the next week. In that sense, this certainly is a “miracle”. I may not believe this is divine intervention, but I can hardly fault those who do. It certainly is an unlikely and wonderful outcome to the situation.


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  17. 17
    drbuzz0 Says:

            Paul said:

    Just a minor quibble. They are not “Canadian Geese,” they are “Canada Geese.” Or should I say, “were?”

    And you know this how? Have you reviewed their citizenship papers :-P


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  18. 18
    drbuzz0 Says:

            TomInAK said:

    A large number of factors outside the control of the air crew all fell together in an unlikely configuration which allowed the pilot to use his skill and training to pull off what I believe is history’s only successful ditching of a jet airliner.

    That depends on what you consider a ’successful’ ditching of a jet airliner and also what you consider a ‘jet airliner.’ If by ‘airliner’ you mean a plane carrying passengers, as opposed to the same model aircraft, but in a cargo configuration or even as an air refueler, then that rules out a couple otherwise successful ditchings.

    If you consider successful ditching to be 100% survival rate then there are a few that might qualify:

    Japan Airlines Flight 2, 1968 where a DC-8 attempting to land at San Francisco International Airport landed in San Fransisco Bay instead, due to pilot error.

    In 1993 a China Airlines flight was forced into the ocean when a strong wind gust blew it off course during final approach and the pilot could not recover to abort the landing. Everyone survived.

    There were also a couple involving flights by Soviet aircraft such as a Tu-124

    Other ditching have been nearly 100% survival. A couple landed with the aircraft intact and all surviving but a few drown or died of hypothermia there after.

    There is no shortage of smaller planes having successfully ditched in water.


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  19. 19
    TomInAK Says:

    I was unaware of some of the jet ditchings you mentioned, so thanks for doing the research. I’d heard a couple of newscasts citing this as the only successful one ever. I should know better than to trust anything I hear on TV.

    The point remains, though, that lots of stuff outside the control of the actors in this event conspired to make it possible for this outcome to occur. It doesn’t discount the skill of the pilot or crew to acknowledge that divine intervention, fate, or dumb luck played a major role in getting everyone out of the plane alive. Similarly, plenty of factors outside of human control work together to provide you the opportunity to have a safe, enjoyable Christmas dinner with your family. Perhaps you were just trying to make a point, but it seems a bit much to silently stew over the fact that your father thanks God rather than Conagra when he says grace over the turkey & mashed potatoes.


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  20. 20
    drbuzz0 Says:

            TomInAK said:

    The point remains, though, that lots of stuff outside the control of the actors in this event conspired to make it possible for this outcome to occur. It doesn’t discount the skill of the pilot or crew to acknowledge that divine intervention, fate, or dumb luck played a major role in getting everyone out of the plane alive.

    Yes that’s true. There is an element here of simply “luck” although I don’t believe in luck, so to be more accurate there’s an element of “The uncontrolled randomness of events by sheer chance just happened to be favorable to this outcome”

    But you don’t thank dumb luck or offer praise to the nature of a chaotic system. There’s no point in thanking the meaningless bouncing of atoms that happened to come out in your favor. People can be thanked and appreciated, they actually get something out of it.


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  21. 21
    DV82XL Says:

            drbuzz0 said:

    There is an element here of simply “luck” although I don’t believe in luck, so to be more accurate there’s an element of “The uncontrolled randomness of events by sheer chance just happened to be favorable to this outcome”

    I don’t believe in luck ether, but if I did I’d likely say that their luck was not as bad as it could have been. Better ‘luck’ would have had the flight uneventfully reach its destination. In other words, ‘good luck’ like this is indistinguishable from ‘bad luck.’


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  22. 22
    Bruce Says:

    Well, I’m an atheist too, actually I think our government should be atheist and teach people atheism in school like Russia used to, but being offended about people thanking god is a bit silly IMO. It’s just a saying, I say it to.

    I mean, if atheists are going to start getting offended about stuff all the time then they look just as silly and petty as the religions right wingnuts. What used to attract me to atheists was that they were all business. It’s like the religious hyprocrites complainning about people saying “god damnit.” I guess that’s the new century, everyone’s always offended about something.

    I think we should focus on things that are really offensive, like right wingers like Rush Limbaugh with their hate speach and talk radio. Bringing back the fairness doctrine is something worth attention IMO.


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  23. 23
    DV82XL Says:

            Bruce said:

    Well, I’m an atheist too, actually I think our government should be atheist and teach people atheism in school like Russia used to, but being offended about people thanking god is a bit silly IMO. It’s just a saying, I say it to.

    You have a point, a flimsy one mind you, but a point nonetheless. However it is one thing to utter a stock phrase and another thing when people forget that it was the efforts of others to which they owe their lives, and this is what this post was about.

    Atheism isn’t taught BTW. Atheism is the absence of religion, not a philosophy unto itself.


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  24. 24
    curious Says:

    Maybe it is to soon to bring this up but I find myself somewhat obsessed with a few things I have noticed by studying the photos and live video. I guess I am curious how and what I would do..

    1. The back exits were cracked open as a few passengers had said as well as looking at the photos. Could the crew have warned ahead of time to not open the back exits? I wonder if the plane started to sink much faster because of this?

    2.. It seems unbelievable but then again god only knows what I would end up doing but so many of the passengers neither had a cushion or the life vests available under the seats. Could the crew have forewarned to take a life vest or cushion? Why were there so few people who had a cushion or a vest?

    3. I hear this “women and children first” stuff. A bit antiquated if you ask me. I am a forty something female and would much prefer they concentrate on the sick, disabled, elderly and children. Since my job loss in May I have gained 50 lbs and don’t get as cold as I used to. I wonder if the very skinny should have gone first?

    4. What’s up with the photos of passengers dragging or carrying out luggage? This is what scares me most about flying is the “entitlement” other passengers seem to have. For example as observed at the end of any flight, inevitably there are a few passengers who stand in the isle and take forever to get their luggage while the whole plane waits to depart behind them. A simple question here.. Why? I would be hard pressed to be risking my life out on the wing for a passenger carrying a huge bag without a vest and fell in.

    5. I hope the second ferry knew ahead of time the dangers of the current and the slippery wing situation. In the coast guard video what seems to be happening is the current pushing second ferry around into the raft at the front of the plane extremely fast and powerful looking.

    6. Again, god only knows what I would have done. I just am pretty confident that I would have had a seat cushion in my hand within 5 seconds of hitting the water.

    7. I have not read or seen any videos of crew assistance.. Was there crew assistance?


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  25. 25
    drbuzz0 Says:

            Bruce said:

    Well, I’m an atheist too, actually I think our government should be atheist and teach people atheism in school like Russia used to, but being offended about people thanking god is a bit silly IMO. It’s just a saying, I say it to.

    I wouldn’t want atheism to be taught in schools because I don’t really see how you could teach it. It’s the absence of religion and you can’t teach the absence of something. You could just tell kids over and over that there is no god and the claims that there are are all silly, but that starts to move from teaching into indoctrinating which I don’t think the educational system should do in general. (Call it a slippery slope argument)

    The notion that there is a higher power is not directly fallible. What you can do is demonstrate that there is no reason to presume one exists and that the claims specific to religions are fallible. Also, I think that a belief system is something that a person has to come up with on their own.

    My preference would be to see schools teaching more of the basic science and perception kind of stuff in order to encourage skeptical and critical thinking. I’d like students to learn about things like logical fallacies, a history of how societies have been manipulated or fallen for things, how scams are perpetrated and also some of the unique quirks of the human condition, like how the placebo effect works, how false memories can occur, the kinds of illusions people are commonly fooled by and that kind of thing. Also the scientific method and why controls and double-blind studies are important.

    I really think that things would be a lot better if people had a grasp of such concepts and religion is one of the first things that many would reject.


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  26. 26
    drbuzz0 Says:

            curious said:

    3. I hear this “women and children first” stuff. A bit antiquated if you ask me. I am a forty something female and would much prefer they concentrate on the sick, disabled, elderly and children. Since my job loss in May I have gained 50 lbs and don’t get as cold as I used to. I wonder if the very skinny should have gone first?

    I believe in these situations old chivalry is less important than the practical matters. Usually those nearest the exits get out of the plane first because they’d be blocking others if they didn’t leave. The ones nearest the exit doors may be required to open them and then to assist people, but you’d still want to go from the closest to the furthers from the exits so you didn’t have people climbing over eachother. In this situation the plane wouldn’t really be in imediate danger becasue it kept floating for a while and so maintaining order and getting the people out in an organized manner seems like the most important. Someone who is injured, I guess you’d want to clear out the people around them first so you’d have room to carry them out.

    As for who gets picked up the first by the boats, I’d imagine the highest priority would be anyone in the water and then anyone who was soaking wet or very cold. The passengers who were on the wing or a raft and were basically dry wouldn’t be as high a priority because they’d be able to wait a bit without being in severe danger of any kind.

    I’m not entirely sure about what the best thing to do with someone who is injured would be. If they were dry and on a high part of the plane and were not in immediate danger, and if the crew or others were keeping them calm and everything, then if I were on a ferry I’d be inclined to leave them for the fire department or police boats to pick up. I’m assuming they’d be there within minutes and they’d be better equipped to pick up someone like that without causing injury. I wouldn’t want someone with fractured bones being manhandled onto the deck of a ferry by untrained passengers if it was not completely necessary because that could make matters worse.


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  27. 27
    MarkHB Says:

    I’ve said my bit in many words about this elsewhere, but I can sum up simply (and I’m sure you’ll all thank me for being brief).

    If you want me to believe in miracles, show me a submarine soft-landed on a cloud. Until then, stop trying to make out than humans can’t be competent, and that all good things come from your Invisible Friend. Thank you.


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  28. 28
    Tannera Says:

    Might try a spell check and grammar check next time. Lots of errors.

    “testiment”
    “would haven’t have had to go down at all.”
    “manuver”
    “panicing”
    etc.


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  29. 29
    drbuzz0 Says:

            Tannera said:

    Might try a spell check and grammar check next time. Lots of errors.

    “testiment”
    “would haven’t have had to go down at all.”
    “manuver”
    “panicing”
    etc.

    Yeah I’m a horrible speller. I always run a spell check when writing posts but somehow it must not have been turned on in this one. For some strange reason the spell check occasionally does not flag words in the post like it’s supposed to automatically do.


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  30. 30
    NYPESTPRO Says:

    I think that while it wasn’t a miracle the guy really did a great job of handling the situation. I dont know how i would handle it.


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  31. 31
    dboy Says:

            Chem Geek Gregor said:

    So what else is new?

    People always credit god for good things but don’t blame him for the bad.

    “Yeah, I’d thank god for letting me live, except I’d really have preferred if he hadn’t sent my plane into the river to begin with.” Sometimes when someone dies they even spin it to god’s credit. “He wanted her back sooner because she’s an angel” or something.

    Bull****!

    It’s amazing to me how negative you are.You clearly aren’t seeing that you’re unbelief has caused you to grow into a bitter human being.From the moment we breath our first breath,our bodies our doomed to die.As a matter of fact,that is the only thing that is gauranteed in life,to die,exept of course the awesome sensation that one feels when submerced in prayer and fasting.Their are many scientific facts out there that support the bible.You should do you’re research.I will pray that you find wisdom.Here is a tip, The fear of God is the begining of wisdom.God bless you pal,be cool


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  32. 32
    Finrod Says:

    @dboy:

    God has cursed your effort to evangelise Chem Geek Gregor by confusing your understanding of the quote function to make you look like a twerp. You are clearly not favoured of Him. Best you increase your efforts at fasting and prayer. Especially fasting. You can add some flaggellation too. In this way, perhaps God will eventually forgive you and readmitt you to His grace.


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  33. 33
    DV82XL Says:

            Finrod said:

    You can add some flagellation too. In this way, perhaps God will eventually forgive you and readmitt you to His grace.

    I strongly concur with you Finrod, mortification of the flesh is definitely warranted here, it is the only prescription that will do in a case like this.


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  34. 34
    drbuzz0 Says:

            dboy said:

    exept of course the awesome sensation that one feels when submerced in prayer and fasting.l

    That sensation you’re talking about – you mean malnutrition-induced delirium?


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  35. 35
    NA Says:

    I appreciate this article, even one year after the accident. This accident became renown as the “miracle on Hudson River” yet like you I believe that credit goes to the crew of the plane, the passengers, and the rescuers. Of coarse, Nully and his crew did receive plenty of recognition for their actions and Nully constantly states that he was not a hero but was simply doing his job. As he was the captain of the plane, I agree with him and believe he did his job remarkably well. He did not lose his cool and did everything required of him as a pilot in an emergency of the kind. The collaboration and cooperation of the people collectively is absolutely inspiring and cannot be accredited to just one man. He did not learn how to perform an emergency procedure on his own. It was a necessary part of becoming a pilot. And it is not something every man or woman can handle.

    Also appreciate your meatball-spaghetti recreation of ‘god’. Kuddos!


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